Songs in Alphabetical Order in Folder View - HELP PLEASE winSCP

I just got a My Cloud mirror 6 TB and all my songs in Folder view are alphabetical. This is a real pain because I have about 1 TB in music and takes forever to find the artist I want to listen to. I have my folders set up where I have full LP’s in one folder and Various in another.

I have done some research and tried to modify Twonky with winSCP using albumart=‘1’ sortcriteria=’+pv:numberOfThisDisc,+upnp:originalTrackNumber’

When I try to save the file I cannot. Is WD going to do anything about this? If I leave my PC on and use another server like Serviio it is fine. That is not the point, I do not want to keep my PC on all the time to listen to music. If so I could have just added drives to my computer.

Does anybody know a way around this BS?

THANKS

I hope you have the downloadable user guide for your device from WD support and have referred to it.

You must be doing something incorrectly, because I have never had the problem you express. For one thing, ALL my music on my NAS is a direct copy of my iTunes Media folder from my PC. It has music from my CDs, my download service, and even LPs I have digitized in it. (None of my music is from Apple; I just use their free and well constructed iTunes program.)

If you are familiar with iTunes and its iTunes Media folder, everything is in Artist folders, and within those folders are albums by that artist, and inside each album are the tracks in order they are on album. If your music collection is not arranged like this, but by some other way, well, I am no help.

I copied the one large folder to the NAS and when it was finished it is like looking at same folder as on my PC. If you did something like this I might be able to help, fine, but it you did it some other way, I likely can’t.

So before you go blaming WD for your problems, figure out where the “user error” came from.

If I search with Itunes or the cloud in ARTISTS the songs are in the correct order. It is only when I use the folder search and play then with my Cambridge Audio CNX streamer they are in alphabetical order. They have many post on this issue and nobody has a fix. At one point you could change the Twonky settings to correct this but not any more.
THANKS

Hi I’m having the same problem using Cambridge Audio with CXA and CXN I’ve been in touch with threir support recommends using the Bubble upnp App. as their own App. is useless. Also on their support page it indicates they are aware of the issue and are working on it. Hope this helps.

OK, I have replicated your issue and see your problem, and have a solution. Your mention of Twonky gave me a clue. Like many others, you do not fully understand the distinction and subtleties of viewing/accessing media by the two main Methods, they are:

  1. From a media server (aka uPnP, DLNA or Media server device)
    or
  2. From a shared drive (aka SAMBA, SMB or Network share.)

By your comments, I can tell you are using method #1 to access your music, but you should be using method #2. This way, you will see your music as you do on the PC as if it was a not a NAS, but just as a drive connected to your PC.

Twonky only comes into usage if using method #1. A media server needs a media player (e.g. Twonky) as part of it to send decoded media to a DLNA device such as a Smart TV, because it “pushes” the actual audio stream to a device it will be listened to on.

On the other hand, when method #2 is used, media (e.g. music) is “pulled” by a device (in this case your PC,) and is played by a program on the PC (e.g. Windows Media Player, or VLC, etc.) The program does the decoding and playing. Twonky server is NOT needed at all; it is used only for method #1

Method #2 is the method I play music on my PC if I want to play music on it.

This whole concept carries over when using apps on mobile devices. Some apps only see servers, others only see shares; a few apps see both.

Here is an example of how this works on my Win 8 PC. In Win File Explorer, I see the My Cloud NAS two places: Under the heading This PC (aka Computer) and under the Network heading. Under This PC is the method #1, Media server view, and when I click to open I do not see my actual folders, I see folders for Music, Photos and Videos folders. This is a dead giveaway one is looking at Media server/DLNA prepared folders.

When I go to access My Cloud under the heading Network and click to open it, I see all the folders on my NAS, one is named Public, so I click on it, see Shared Music, and open that folder and see my iTunes Media folder. I go into it and see all my artist folders, inside are albums for each artist, open an album and see all the tracks in album order they are in album order; not in alpha order!

Alpha order is how tracks are arranged for DLNA delivery, and I don’t know why, or even care.

The only time I use method #1 is because a media server can play from music playlists, I have a lot of them, so I use it for that.

I hope this clears things up for you and others. Just this past week I explained this issue for someone who was having similar issues using a WDTV. The comments I gave him explained the issue for him and he thanked me a lot for helping him figure out his issue. So, click on the link for this thread to read the entire post.

Thanks Mike for your help. I wanted to use the Cloud as my media server with my computer OFF! I have used many servers like Serviio and Asset. When I use the cloud like this it is fine and I can see my Artists with the songs in the correct order with FOLDER View or Artist/Album view. I have over 1 TB of music with thousands of artists. I have my folders set up by Genre and then have a separate folder for Various Artists. That VA folder cause a big mess because of all the separate artists. That is why I like to use folder view so I can drill down to a specific group instead of looking at thousands of artists.
I bought the My Cloud so that it would be a music server. I do not want to keep my PC on all the time. That is the main issue. Someone posted a fix a few years ago but WD has made it impossible to edit the string with winSCP.
This is the Fix but we cannot do it!

OK got it, and BTW I can use my NAS as a server with PC OFF and locate my music via SMB shares (not via server means) and see my music as I want to and play it as I want to. I will look into link you sent and see what I can figure out there, but will be gone now for a few hours and can’t do so now. Later. Mike

Meanwhile, tell me exactly what equipment you will use, and any apps you may use on mobile device to accomplish this. I also am not familiar with the Cambridge Audio CNX streamer so will look into it as well. My guess it is a DLNA-only receiving device, so I’ll see about that, too…

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Thanks Mike, I appreciate your time. I am using only the Cambridge Audio APP. Another user Rod has the same player and said that Cambridge is aware of the problem and working on it. I might be a problem with their App. If I use the players controls on the unit then I can search by folders and everything is fine. So now that I am thinking about it the problem might be with Cambridge Audio APP. But then again the App works fine when I go through my PC.

This is probably a useless cause. The CXN is a $1200 streamer, you would think they have the bugs worked out. http://www.crutchfield.com/p_779CXNB/Cambridge-Audio-CXN-Black.html?tp=181&awkw=133356779065&awat=pla&awnw=g&awcr=70145278465&awdv=c

OK, back home and found what I wanted to know from Cambridge Audio website. As I suspected, your CXN Network Player is a uPnP device – just like a Smart TV is. Like a Smart TV, one does not need to set up a home network with shared drives or devices. They both just receive the media via a Media server that is “broadcast” (sort of) through the router/network from, (in your case,) the My Cloud NAS. This makes DLNA easy to use for anyone, but with a cost, as you have found that your stored music is not in exact album track order. This is not a bug or defect with either the My Cloud or the CXN. It is just the way it is with devices whose media input comes from uPnP Media servers.

From the CXN webpage about the iOS app that controls it:
“(The app) locates uPnP servers on your network, makes sense of the folder structure and lists content metadata, all without skipping a beat.”

I know you spent a lot of money for the CXN and darn well want to use it. Here is a way you can, and play tracks in the correct order

The CXN accepts USB inputs, so attach a small portable drive to it with all your music on it. The CXN will power a small drive. You can update your music using your My Cloud, I believe. Before you get a drive to do this and copy all your music to it, do a test run first. Copy enough of the structure of your music folders on the NAS that represents it’s actual structure onto an external or portable drive. (If it were me, I would copy the beginning part of folders in my iTunes Media folder.) I would connect drive to the CXN and see how it goes. It will be fast since it is an attached drive and it will be seen as an attached drive that can be played from in the order you want it to.
Presuming your test run worked out fine, then obtain at least a 1 or 2 TB portable drive to copy all your music on. My iTunes contains over 12,300 tracks of music and takes up 103 GB of disk space.

Before I mention any drive brands, I do want to say get a drive that has a sleep mode (aka idle feature) that activates after 5 or 10 minutes of non-use. When accessed, drive wakes up. You do not want this drive spinning 24/7. Most new portable drives today have a built-in sleep mode, and sometimes there is no way to know other than letting it sit idle for a while and check it (by careful listening) that it spins down after 5-10 minutes. I have some Seagate drives that allow for user idle adjustment, but that is actually a small hassle. I prefer my other drives that have the built-in (no brainer) sleep mode.

Anyway, WD portable drives are a logical choice, but WD also owns HGST (which was previously the Hitachi drive company.) In fact, I have a small HGST 1TB drive with media on it connected to my router’s USB port that I can access from anywhere. This drive was less than a $100 on sale, and is about the size and thickness of an iPhone. I also have a small 2TB Toshiba portable (bought on sale for a little over $100) and some Seagate Portables. My first portable drives were WD ones, but they don’t appear to have a sleep mode; newer ones likely do. Anyway, get the size you need now and for future.

You can also still access your music via the My Cloud, but I would only do so if I was using it to play music from Playlists to the CXN.

Write back and let me know how this all turns out and ends. I’d like to know. Good luck with this.

Hi Mike,
Thanks for all your help. I already have a WD passport 1TB drive. When I use it with my CNX I hear a noise between songs and on quiet parts of the song. That is why I bought the Cloud to eliminate the noise. The Cloud does not have any noise between songs and is dead silent. I really would like to use the Cloud for my streamer.

What kind of noise? Is it mechanical from the drive itself, or in the audio sound?
How old is the drive? Maybe you need a new one.

FYI Below is a copy of the emails I had with Cambridge Audio. I think they are at a loss as how to resolve it. The CNX & CNA are great pieces of kit let down by a very poor App. and support and this is reflected in many of its reviews. As previously stated I went back to the shop where I bought it and they advised me to use Bubble which is a better App but does still not resolve the issue.
I appreciate you time in trying to resolve this issue and will monitor it in the hope a solution can be found.

Rod

Nov 10, 12:06
Sorry for the delay- any update will be made automatically available to the machine and you’ll be asked if you want to proceed. If the App updates, a notification will be made in the Play Store/Ap Store.
Ed
Nov 2, 17:43
Hi I replied 27/10/15 asking to be made aware when the fix has been implemented.
If this is not possible please advise me how I may become aware.
Rod
Oct 27, 18:06
Thanks Ed please let me know when there are any developments.
Rod
Oct 27, 12:48
Thanks Rod, as an update, there seems to be an App bug that the software team is working to resolve it.
Ed
Oct 26, 14:31
Hi Ed below is the firmware number as requested
Firmware No. 000cbd5d
I set up a music folder Network/WDMycloudmirror/Public ….then added various music folders and when I tried it via the Cambridge Android App it worked, and all the track numbers were showing on the App and played in the correct sequence (I’m testing it with The Beatles Love album) however the next time when I had added some additional albums they all reverted to alphabetical.
When you asked me to try putting the albums outside the Public folder on the drive is this what you meant ?
I don’t know if this is appoint worth noting but when tracks are added to the queue they all appear with a number listing their order ( not the track number).
Rod
Oct 26, 10:05
I’m not sure why this wouldn’t work. Do you have your unit ID number? This is found in the settings menu under firmware and starts with three digits?
Regards
Ed

Oct 20, 14:24
Hi Ed it says Public folder/Shared Music/Artists, if you think I should try a different folder structure let me know and I’ll try, as this matter is now becoming very frustrating trying to play classical and musical albums.
Rod
Oct 19, 16:16
This crops up from time to time with a variety of NAS drives. Are you using the ‘Shared Music’ folder or a generic share on the NAS?
Oct 16, 12:58
Hi Ed, tried that and it played in the correct order. So I seem to have established that I the files on the WD hard drive are defaulted to alphabetical, so I need to work out a way to sort numerical in their folders, possibly through Windows. By the way the NAS drive I’m using is a WD My Cloud Mirror have you come across this issue before ?
Rod
Oct 16, 12:07
If you put an album on a USB stick and read it from there, is the order correct? It is possible that the NAS is over-riding the order.
Oct 16, 11:40
Hi Ed, I’ve used Mp3tag, although all my files are FLAC. When I play an album using the remote control the seem to play in the correct order. I’ve also used the Bubble app and although this is slightly better it also sometimes reverts to alphabetical.
If there is any further information you require please let me know.
Oct 15, 17:47
Dear Sir, thanks for your inquiry,
Please can you confirm what software was used to tag the files? Can you also confirm what format they are in? Generally we recommend Perfect Tunes as the best option to sort issues like this out but it is worth knowing what tagging has already been applied.
Oct 14, 15:09
Playing music from WD NAS wired to CXN
I’m finding that use the Cambridge Audio App on Android devices the Music is listed in alphabetical order rather than track number order. This very annoying particularly when play pieces of music that should be listened too as a single piece.
All my music has been tagged with track number order & file number order to coincide. Please can you offer any assistance as this matter is becoming very annoying having to listen to disjointed albums.

Hi Mike,
The drive is not making any noise. The noise is in the audio. Hard to explain the sounds, like maybe sounds like the drive is trying to access a folder. It is really just in the beginning of any song. If I use a usb stick I do not hear any sounds in the audio.
THANKS

Michael,

A clear sign that the particular audio sound is coming from the Passport drive. Could be a flaky USB connection. Digital tracks (other than ones from LPs!) don’t have noise.

I know you don’t want to spend more money, but I would get a new drive, myself. I think you are in UK (I am in US) so here is an Amazon UK link to HGST 1 TB USB 3 drive (with a sleep mode) that I have. Small and quiet. If not in UK, go to whatever Amazon you use and look up this drive.

Mike, Thanks again for your help. I think my passport is OK. The weird noise I hear is only using headphones with my WOO AUDIO Tube headphone amp. I think it is RFI or something leaking into the signal because the amp is very close to the Passport. I am very picky, anal, ETC and the average user would probably not even notice the noise.

Anyway, I got the cloud to work properly in folder view by using the ANDROID BUBLE app. I mainly use my iPod with the CA app but after reading the Rod_Billo post I took out an old Android tablet and got the Bubble App. When I first tried the songs were in alphabetical order. Then I was playing around with the settings in Bubble and found keep songs in numerical order. Once I checked that off now everything is working properly. I wish Bubble was available for iPhone because my tablet is old and SLOW. But the APP does do what I want.

THANKS SO MUCH

Well, thank you so much, too. I have been learning things all along in this discussion, too.

So, I also have an Android tablet; an Amazon Kindle tablet. I figured the BUBBLE app you referred to was Bubble uPnP. There is a Kindle version of app and I installed it. I have heard good things about this app, but never tried it. I also noticed I could view music as coming from a Media server or a network share when accessing the music from My Cloud, and could see tracks arranged in alpha or track order. Excellent that it can help control your CNX. I would say the issue is solved, so be sure to check he Solved box on your way out of this thread.

Regarding the headphone issue. It appears you were using a wireless or Bluetooth headset, and both of those are notorious for creating noise in audio. Did you also check it with a wired headphone? That should have real clear sound. Take care, Mike

HI,
Thanks again. I am using a wired Sennheiser HD-800 headphones. The top of the line from the company. It has something to do with the TUBE headphone amp I am using. If I plug directly in my pre-amp I do not hear any noise in the audio. I should have tried that before but my main concern was the track order.
THANKS AGAIN!

Top of line headphones better not need a headphone amp!

I know this topic is old, but has this been resolved? I believe the issue is how Twonky reads the Metadata. for WAV where MD is scarce, it takes the file name, but for FLAC, it takes the song name and perhaps it is not passing track nbr, therefore the client receives the information in Alpha order.
Any ideas?

Also…does anybody know what Tag is Twonky using to sort songs? just Track name or any track nbr tag?