Audio Sync Issues

WD Legacy Products WD TV Live & Live Plus
1

Hi there - looking for some guidance.  I’ve read many threads regarding sound issues and can’t seem to find a solid answer.  I am having audio issues playing both .mkv and .avi files.  My videos are stored on WD External Harddrives and connecting via USB.  Video is great but audio is almost always slightly off.  I’ve tried pausing and playing again.  I’ve tried stopping and restarting. Same issue.  I’ve noticed others say this is a problem with .mkv files but I’m having it with .avi’s too.  I’ve tested each of these movies by playing on just my PC and the audio is always fine.

I’ve upgraded to the latest firmware (1.01.24) and that didn’t help.  I thought about reverting to older firmware but don’t know how and don’t know if that’s even a potential solution.  Any thoughts?

Before purchasing this WD TV Live product, I used to run through my PC and play movies via Boxee.  Whenever there were simialr audio issues i was able to manually adjust the sound which always fixed it.  I see through other threads that this is not possible with WD TV  Live… getting frustrated that playing simple movies via this product has audio issues like this. 

Any help is much appreciated…

2

Have tried searching this issue on the forum?  There has been plenty of discussion about this issue.  Maybe you can find a fix for you from it.

3

Yes - i spent about an hour on the forums last night.  thats where i saw comments about this being just a .mkv issue (not in my case) or that one needed to upgrade firmware (again, i did this and no fix).  Other than that it was just comments about pausing and stopping - then restarting movie… again no fix there. 

4

I’ve also tried passing the audio to my amp via optical chord and that hasn’t worked either. 

5

I am having the same problem with MKV files, audio gets out of sync, I have to stop and start again, but audio eventually gets out of sync again.

I have audio connected via optical.

6

Re-posting in the correct place! 

Lots of people seem to be asking but I haven’t been able to find a clear answer to this one, so hopefully someone can help. 

WD TV Live

Firmware 1.02.21

DVD Decrypter to rip from DVDs in File mode. 

Handbrake to convert into individual chapters.  (Main focus is music videos.) 

Using High Profile preset, with container set to MKV file. 

Why am I using MKV? 

2 reasons: Using MP4 I see bad video artifacts on the WD TV Live (through my Sanyo projector), and the WD TV Live for some reason sees some of the MP4s as video files and some as music files.  I can’t figure that out! 

What is the problem? 

After a few seconds I start to see the audio/video getting significantly out of sync. 

Does this happen with ALL MKV files? 

Nope.  It only happens with certain DVDs, and I cannot find a root cause of which DVDs have the problem. 

Does this happen with MP4 files?

Nope.  A Handbrake-generated High Profile file is just fine, whether it has a .m4v or .mp4 extension. 

Is it a region problem? 

Nope.  I see exactly the same problem on some DVDs from Region 1 and some DVDs from Region 2/3/4/5. 

Is it a PAL/NTSC problem?

Nope.  Same problem occurs on some PAL DVDs and some NTSC DVDs. 

Do the MKVs exhibit the problem on other media players? 

On a PC using Media Player Classic the files look fine. 

OK, what are the details? 

Here is Media Info details on an MKV file that exhibits the problem:

Complete name                    : C:…Brimful Of Asha.mkv
Format                           : Matroska
File size                        : 91.3 MiB
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Overall bit rate                 : 2 764 Kbps
Writing application              : HandBrake 0.9.4

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L3.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 3 frames
Muxing mode                      : Container profile=Unknown@3.0
Codec ID                         : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Width                            : 720 pixels
Height                           : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate                       : 29.970 fps
Standard                         : NTSC
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Progressive
Writing library                  : x264 core 79
Encoding settings                : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / wpredb=1 / wpredp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=30 / scenecut=40 / rc_lookahead=50 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Color primaries                  : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M
Transfer characteristics         : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients              : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M

Audio
ID                               : 2
Format                           : AAC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version                   : Version 4
Format profile                   : LC
Format settings, SBR             : No
Codec ID                         : A_AAC
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Language                         : English

Menu
00:00:00.000                     : Chapter 01

Here is Media Info detail on an MP4 file of the same chapter that does NOT exhibit the problem:

(There is a second audio track; both show the sync problem.)

General
Complete name                    : C:…Brimful Of Asha.mp4
Format                           : MPEG-4
Format profile                   : Base Media / Version 2
Codec ID                         : mp42
File size                        : 99.6 MiB
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Overall bit rate                 : 3 017 Kbps
Encoded date                     : UTC 2010-07-27 14:05:29
Tagged date                      : UTC 2010-07-27 14:11:59
Writing application              : HandBrake 0.9.4 2009112300

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L3.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 3 frames
Codec ID                         : avc1
Codec ID/Info                    : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Bit rate mode                    : Variable
Bit rate                         : 2 597 Kbps
Width                            : 720 pixels
Height                           : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate mode                  : Variable
Frame rate                       : 29.609 fps
Original frame rate              : 29.970 fps
Minimum frame rate               : 19.973 fps
Maximum frame rate               : 29.970 fps
Standard                         : NTSC
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)               : 0.254
Stream size                      : 85.7 MiB (86%)
Writing library                  : x264 core 79
Encoding settings                : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / wpredb=1 / wpredp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=30 / scenecut=40 / rc_lookahead=50 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Encoded date                     : UTC 2010-07-27 14:05:29
Tagged date                      : UTC 2010-07-27 14:11:59
Color primaries                  : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M
Transfer characteristics         : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients              : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M

Audio #1
ID                               : 2
Format                           : AAC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version                   : Version 4
Format profile                   : LC
Format settings, SBR             : No
Codec ID                         : 40
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Bit rate mode                    : Variable
Bit rate                         : 160 Kbps
Maximum bit rate                 : 196 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Stream size                      : 5.28 MiB (5%)
Language                         : English
Encoded date                     : UTC 2010-07-27 14:05:29
Tagged date                      : UTC 2010-07-27 14:11:59

I would appreciate any pointers! 

TIA,

Mike

7

Mike,

It’s unusual indeed for an MKV file to have these issues (because usually we see this in MP4 files) but I’m going to guess it’s related to the Handbrake version you’re using (even though it’s the last “official” release, it’s very old by Handbrake standards and there have been many many other releases since then).

Handbrake .94 did have some issues with audio sync on some DVDs due to using “same as source” on the frame rate.  In any case, it’s worth a try using a newer version (go to the Handbrake forums and see the note about downloading one of the nightlies).  After you try one of your problem files you can post back here and let us know if this fixes things or not. (it may also be the way you are ripping – I’d try a demo of AnyDVD just to be sure of that as well, and rip the entire disc).

(BTW, I use Handbrake with the High Profile preset but changed to MKV output  for ALL my DVDs and blu-rays and videos and out of the thousands I have done I have yet to experience any problems playing on my Live units.  But I haven’t used .94 since about November of last year)

8

I see it right away.   It’s Variable Frame Rate (at least the MP4 thinks it is, but the MKV does NOT.)

I’m guessing when you encode you’ll see a BUNCH of

Video → Film

Film → Video 

references in the EncodeLog / Activity Window.

Older versions of Handbrake (0.9.4 included) did not do well on some VFR material. 

Go download a Nightly and re-code and see if that fixes it.

9

Ah – good catch, Tony (it was too early in the morning for me, although I *did* give him the right advice about getting the latest version of Handbrake :>)

10

Gents,

Many thanks for your quick responses and pointers.  Since posting this I had started to notice your comments about Handbrake dailies and was thinking about trying it, so I’m glad you confirmed that was a likely solution. 

So far it is looking promising with Handbrake daily 3462, still using the High Profile preset with the MKV container.  I have confirmed 2 of the DVDs that were problematic are now ok, so I’m starting to re-rip others.  Painful and time-consuming, but not as bad as if I had already ripped the entire collection! 

It was certainly not obvious that Handbrake was the source of the problem because the files worked with other media players but not with the WD TV Live.  I guess the media players all have their own idiosyncracies as well! 

Just one question.  By using the High Profile preset I am still using “same as source” framerate, hence I still have Variable Frame Rate files.  The difference is that now the MKV produced by Handbrake does recognize the Frame Rate Mode as Variable.  Is this a good idea, or do you suggest I use a fixed frame rate, and would you suggest using 29.97? 

For comparison the two MKV files look like thise:

MKV using Handbrake 0.9.4

********

General
Complete name                    : C:…Brimful Of Asha.mkv
Format                           : Matroska
File size                        : 91.3 MiB
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Overall bit rate                 : 2 764 Kbps
Writing application              : HandBrake 0.9.4

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L3.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 3 frames
Muxing mode                      : Container profile=Unknown@3.0
Codec ID                         : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Width                            : 720 pixels
Height                           : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate                       : 29.970 fps
Standard                         : NTSC
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Progressive
Writing library                  : x264 core 79
Encoding settings                : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.0:0.0 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / mbaff=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=0 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / wpredb=1 / wpredp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=30 / scenecut=40 / rc_lookahead=50 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Color primaries                  : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M
Transfer characteristics         : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients              : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M

Audio
ID                               : 2
Format                           : AAC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version                   : Version 4
Format profile                   : LC
Format settings, SBR             : No
Codec ID                         : A_AAC
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Language                         : English

Menu
00:00:00.000                     : Chapter 01

MKV using Handbrake daily 3462

********

General
Complete name                    : C:…Brimful Of Asha.mkv
Format                           : Matroska
File size                        : 96.4 MiB
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Overall bit rate                 : 2 918 Kbps
Writing application              : HandBrake svn3462
Writing library                  : libmkv 0.6.4.1

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L3.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 4 frames
Muxing mode                      : Container profile=Unknown@3.0
Codec ID                         : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration                         : 4mn 37s
Width                            : 720 pixels
Height                           : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate mode                  : Variable
Frame rate                       : 29.970 fps
Standard                         : NTSC
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Progressive
Writing library                  : x264 core 104 r1681 84a051f
Encoding settings                : cabac=1 / ref=3 / deblock=1:0:0 / analyse=0x3:0x113 / me=hex / subme=7 / psy=1 / psy_rd=1.00:0.00 / mixed_ref=1 / me_range=16 / chroma_me=1 / trellis=1 / 8x8dct=1 / cqm=0 / deadzone=21,11 / fast_pskip=1 / chroma_qp_offset=-2 / threads=6 / sliced_threads=0 / nr=0 / decimate=1 / interlaced=0 / constrained_intra=0 / bframes=3 / b_pyramid=2 / b_adapt=2 / b_bias=0 / direct=1 / weightb=1 / open_gop=0 / weightp=2 / keyint=300 / keyint_min=29 / scenecut=40 / intra_refresh=0 / rc_lookahead=50 / rc=crf / mbtree=1 / crf=20.0 / qcomp=0.60 / qpmin=10 / qpmax=51 / qpstep=4 / ip_ratio=1.40 / aq=1:1.00
Color primaries                  : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M
Transfer characteristics         : BT.709-5, BT.1361
Matrix coefficients              : BT.601-6 525, BT.1358 525, BT.1700 NTSC, SMPTE 170M

Audio #1
ID                               : 2
Format                           : AAC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Audio Codec
Format version                   : Version 4
Format profile                   : LC
Format settings, SBR             : No
Codec ID                         : A_AAC
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Language                         : English

Audio #2
ID                               : 3
Format                           : AC-3
Format/Info                      : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension                   : CM (complete main)
Codec ID                         : A_AC3
Duration                         : 4mn 36s
Bit rate mode                    : Constant
Bit rate                         : 256 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth                        : 16 bits
Stream size                      : 8.45 MiB (9%)
Language                         : English

I will post a further update when I have confirmed some more DVDs. 

Thanks again,

Mike

11

If you have variable frame rate files do not attempt to change that – Handbrake will correctly handle that now (by leaving same as source) and the Live will play them correctly.

12

Great.  Thanks a lot for confirming Mike. 

Cheers,

Mike