Okay, I have a wierd issue here…on firmware 1.02.21, whenever I am browsing my iso video files across a network share with a wired network connection, as I page down to look at different files to find a movie I want to watch and I have gone through a few screens worth of thumbnails, my device will lock up and not respond to any remote commands (must do a hard power reset). I have about 400 movies loaded on two drives on my NAS, and it doesn’t matter which drive I navigate to the problem happens on either one. Now the wierd part…I RMA’d my device thinking it was a hardware issue, got the new one and it does the same thing. So next, I thought maybe it was the way I was storing my movies, so I moved them from my NAS to my HP server and still it locks up.
Now the really wierd part…I downgraded my firmware to 1.01.17 and the problem went away! Problem solved right? Only now I get the nagging firmware update available everytime I power on my device…normally not an issue with me, but I just ordered 3 more boxes for my kids to use and I know they will eventually click the upgrade option and I will be forever having to roll back the firmware. I am waiting on the newest firmware to come out so I can see if the problem replicates, but I have a feeling it will still be there.
Anyone have any thoughts about what could be causing this in the newer firmware and not the older one?
Actually they are in individual folders with only one iso and its matching jpg in each folder and then all of those folders in a parent movie folder. I suppose I could split up the folders even further than the two parent folders on separate drives as it is now, but at what point do I create another new folder…100 movies, 50, 25? I just think it is odd that an older firmware corrects the problem.
I have over 1700 files in my shares (plus around 10,000 audio tracks) and I’ve never encountered that behavior.
If you’re already well organized into folders, I can’t imagine what the issue would be.
I have a Live+, a Live running Beta, and a Live running Stock and haven’t had a problem in just BROWSING my stuff.
Have you tried doing just a full reset? There may be something just stuck on stupid in there after the upgrade.
EDIT: One difference for me is that I DON’T use thumbnails as a rule. So that could be a difference…
If your process is repeatable and reproducable, try moving the thumbnails OFF the share temporarily and see if that clears up the problem. (Then you could move them back later.)
I am receiving my 3 new boxes today and will attempt to reproduce the issue with them running the latest firmware. If the problem replicates on the new boxes then I will know it must be an issue with the newest firmware and how I have my files stored. My second test will be your suggestion about moving the thumbnails off and see how that works. I will report my findings when I have completed testing.
On a side note…I tried installing B-Rads firmware before I eventually went back to the official version that works for me. His had the same problem as the official firmware, but seemed to last longer before locking up. I realize his is based on the official version and just thought I would mention trying it in case someone was thinking of recommending that as an option.
I can reproduce this problem every time, on all three of my Live units (perhaps Tony just doesn’t have enogh thumbnail space issues – all of mine are 70K or so).
I’ve reported this but the WD folks say they haven’t got a clue. It *appears* to be cache related. The more files I scroll the worse it gets. About the only advice I can give you is the old doctor’s advice (“Doc, it hurts when I do this” – “Don’t do that”) I now am *very* careful about how many thumbs I scroll through (usually I can get through several hundred before it locks up on me, so this mostly happens when I am just browsing through my entire collection).
(Oh, and this has occured with me since I first got my Lives, so it’s not something any version of the firmware has fixed or caused).
I was thinking along the same lines as you, probably a cache issue but not everyone experiences it, so that’s weird.
As an update…I received and installed my three new live boxes all of which shipped with firmware 1.01.12. I upgraded all three to 1.01.17, then as a test, I upgraded only one to 1.02.21. The drive with the latest firmware reproduced the thumbnail scrolling lockup issue within a few minutes. I downgraded it to 1.01.17 and the issue is gone. I was going to move the thumbnails off the drives and test again, but they are in individual folders and that just isn’t worth the effort of restoring them later.
So to summarize…I have tested three different live boxes with firmware 1.02.21 installed browsing through video thumbnails of 400+ movies stored in individual folders on both a NAS with two 2TB drives as well as on a server spread across four drives and all three boxes caused the lockup issue. I have tested five different live boxes with firmware 1.01.17 installed and none have replicated the lockup. I guess I just have to deal with the annoying firmware upgrade ■■■■■ light. Why is it that most manufacturers are content with allowing their customers to go out and find new firmware, but WD has to tell you about it every time you turn on their box and won’t give the option of disabling it? If I have a firmware that works for me and a newer one doesn’t, give me the option of turning off the new firmware notification.
I’m going to bring this thread to the attention of the WD folks and let’s see if we can get some movement on it (as I said, they couldn’t find anything when I mentioned it, but perhaps this will get it moving again).
Sounds good to me. I am certainly willing to try other testing to attempt to narrow down exactly what will/will not cause the problem to occur. As I stated earlier, I have four different boxes that I can utilize for testing. I originally thought the problem occurred because of the speed of which I was scrolling through the files was causing the box to become “confused” with what to display and forcing it to lock up, but I tried scrolling very slowly as well and it still locks.
You stated earlier that you have had the problem since receiving your boxes regardless of the firmware version. Can you say for sure that it still happens with firmware 1.01.17? Just curious if that firmware contains different code that solves the issue, or if it is just the combination of that firmware and my particular storage style that corrects it for me.
I have the latest released version of firmware and still have that issue. It’s not all the time, but if I browse a ton of thumbs I can definitely reproduce it (I just don’t try and browse too many at one time nowadays).
I did post it to the WD staff but haven’t heard anything yet. We’ll see if they will respond or not (they are busy people nowadays).
Im having the same issue. I have 350+ files in a folder with thumbs and browsing through half of them the unit locks. I tried grouping in folders and still have the same issue. The newest beta firmware has the same issue. I now downgraded to 1.01.17 and everything is working good. Thanks^
One solution to the upgrade notification issue might be to install one of the homebrew firmwares based on 1.01.17. It won’t bug you for the update and it should still be free of the issues.
I can’t recommend this as a fix simply because it’s not a “true” fix and it has the potential to cause some issues depending on where you get your firmware version and how experienced you are with those sort of things. It could also void your warranty. If you don’t feel comfortable with any of that, please don’t do it.
WD tech has now said they are aware of this issue but it’s not a high priority right now (and don’t shoot the messenger – I’m not happy about it either, guys).
So all we can do is wait and hope that it makes its way up the list to where they actually fix it some day (frankly, WD’s attitude about thumbnail issues kind of ■■■■■ – it’s the only reason I’ve looked into other solutions like the Popbox, which at this point has way more problems than the Live ever did).
And, in an effort to teach me ironry, one of my own units again locked up last night in this very thing (sigh).
Well, sounds like it is more widespread than just a couple of people. At least WD has admitted there is a problem, and that is the first step on the road to recovery. Glad the downgraded firmware works for some at least. I have contemplated trying the homebrew option, but at this point the upgrade firmware ■■■■■ light is just an annoyance I can live with.
Perhaps someone (B-Rad) can create a patch that just disables the upgrade firmware message without changing anything else on the box, that’s something I would pay money for.
One thing I’ve found that helps is to keep the size of the thumbs as small as possible – you can still get some good quality images with only 20K or so. This is definitely a cache issue, so the smaller the size of the thumbs the less the memory gets hung up.
Hopefully this as well as the duplicate thumbs will get addressed *sometime* (I’m guessing about 8-9 months but that’s only an educated guess. WD still doesn’t see this as any big deal so it might NEVER get fixed).
Be careful about using non alphabetical characters in file names, (including spaces), long file names over 16 characters and big thumbnail files over 100k in size.
Its my opinion if you have a huge library use a net share or media server first and a local drive last.
