Network Throughput on EX4 to EX4 Remote Backup Job

Hi

Hope someone can help explain this to me.

I have 2 seperate EX4’s, both with 4 x 4TB disks in a RAID5 array giving 12TB usable space.  Settings on both are identical (except one is set for remote backup).  Both are on latest firmware.

I have only just set the second EX4 up (got it to give me a backup of the first), so I setup a remote backup job from the main one to the new one.  The job is for a single share which contains 9TB of data.

Problem is that the throughput is terrible.  In 24 hours I got barely 500GB copied over.  Stats on EX4 show transmission rate as roughly 6.5MB.  

Both EX4’s are connected using a single network interface each to the same gigabit switch, and nothing else on the network is accessing the EX4’s at the moment.

Any idead why transfer is so slow, and what I could do to improve it?  At this rate I’ll be waiting 15 days for the copy to go through.

Thank you in advance

Slowness of this unit is quite pronounced and this fourm has MANY threads discussing the archilies heel of this unit being the SLOWness

I’ll keep an eye on this thread to see what the mods or other others can contribute

My 2 cents… …at two of these units your getting serious into storing your stuff… f your in the return period of these slow dogs… return them asap and step upto Synology NAS or IxSystems ZFS based NAS

Just noticed that the CPU on both units is jumping between 80% and 99% utilisation.  The remote EX4 is the one running the highest though. I wonder if this is the limiting factor to throughput.

Why the CPU is being so heavily used to simply copy data is a mystery though.

The files being copier are all large data files.  Anything between 4GB and 50GB each.  Around 75% of the roughly 1000 files in this share will be 4-5GB in size.  The files will not change once the copy is complete but will be added to over time.

After 42 hours it has done 1TB.  That is an appaling rate on a gigabit network.  I’m looking at 15 days for this to complete.  And whilst that isn’t a huge problem as it is a one-off backup copy, I worry about what 15 days of constant disk access and high CPU will do to the devices longevity.  That said, the devices are running at normal temperatures and fans are not running high, so it isn’t generating much heat.

As a further note, all 8 disks across the two units are all 7200RPM WD Black 4TB disks.

Would throughput be quicker I wonder if I used a computer to initiate the copy and act as middle-man?

Keys76 wrote:

Just noticed that the CPU on both units is jumping between 80% and 99% utilisation.  The remote EX4 is the one running the highest though. I wonder if this is the limiting factor to throughput.

 

Why the CPU is being so heavily used to simply copy data is a mystery though.

 

The files being copier are all large data files.  Anything between 4GB and 50GB each.  Around 75% of the roughly 1000 files in this share will be 4-5GB in size.  The files will not change once the copy is complete but will be added to over time.

 

After 42 hours it has done 1TB.  That is an appaling rate on a gigabit network.  I’m looking at 15 days for this to complete.  And whilst that isn’t a huge problem as it is a one-off backup copy, I worry about what 15 days of constant disk access and high CPU will do to the devices longevity.  That said, the devices are running at normal temperatures and fans are not running high, so it isn’t generating much heat.

 

As a further note, all 8 disks across the two units are all 7200RPM WD Black 4TB disks.

 

Would throughput be quicker I wonder if I used a computer to initiate the copy and act as middle-man?

Well, the most important and relevant questions are - what kind of files are they and how many files. You have answered the latter - which gives an idea that it’s not a small number but the really important question is then, what types of files are these. Are they media files like videos or music. If so, then that’s the issue. Anytime you copy media files over to the EX2/EX4/Mirror, there are couple different processes that run - wdmcserver and wdphotodbmerger, that index the media files and prep any pics/videos to be shared by the cloud app. Unfortunately, the reality with a lot of NASes out there, including many by Synology and QNAP, two of the leading vendors, suffer from the same issues that WD’s NASes suffer - a weak CPU that is overwhelmed by the processing power required to handle CPU-intensive tasks. So contrary to sgallant04’s claim that just stepping up to a Synology NAS would resolve your issues, I would say that only if you move to a Synology with a non-Marvell CPU but one with an Intel Atom CPU or better. But those higher end CPUs are on NASes that are also much higher priced. If you instead bought a Synology DS414slim which comes with a Marvell Armada 370 chip, you’d be no better off than you are with an EX4 NAS. Also, keep in mind, WD does sell Intell Atom-powered NASes under their business-class Sentinel NAS series, which would give you much better performance at a much higher price point - just like moving to a non-Marvell Synology model would.

The fact remains that performance-wise the cheaper NASes proliferating the market today, whether from Synology or WD or somebody else, will have these slowness issues when it comes to processing media files. And I know you would say, well, I am merely copying the files and not processing or transcoding them, but because majority of folks want to share these media files on the cloud, these processes are mandatorily run on all media files.

You can do a couple things that might help the situation just a bit but not much - you can turn off Media steaming and iTunes music streaming during this time of copying files. That will turn a couple processes like twonkyserver, etc. off…which will give a very small relief to the CPU…but with a weak CPU you just aren’t going to be able to do as much as with a more powerful CPU on a pricier NAS.

The files are all ISO disk image files which my HTPC mounts and then runs as if the disk is inserted.  It has allowed me to put lots of bulky DVD/Bluray disks in boxes in the loft out of the way.

Would think that the NAS would just see these as data files and not try to do any transcoding or prep for cloud.

Incidentally, I also have cloud access turned off as I don’t use it at the moment.

Keys76 wrote:

The files are all ISO disk image files which my HTPC mounts and then runs as if the disk is inserted.  It has allowed me to put lots of bulky DVD/Bluray disks in boxes in the loft out of the way.

 

Would think that the NAS would just see these as data files and not try to do any transcoding or prep for cloud.

 

Incidentally, I also have cloud access turned off as I don’t use it at the moment.

Aah, I see - yes, you are right - there should not be any processing of the DVD/BDMV iso files, I’d think as these would be trated as disk images. But I recently mounted an ISO image with a large number of pictures on my EX2 and the twonkyserver did tae a while to go through the thousands of pics on it - but in your case, yes, I wouldn’t think those ISOs would need any prep work for cloud. And btw, I too have cloud access turned off (as I don’t use it either) - but that doesn’t stop those two processes I mentioned…they’ll run regardless.

BTW, an off-topic question for you…if you don’t have the answer just yet, that’s fine. I never mounted any of my DVD/bluray ISOs but I do have a ton of ISOs sitting on my countless hard drives and about 50 or so sitting on my EX2. I have not mounted those - but the question I have is, do you know what the max number of ISOs we can mount on EX4 (should be the same number I’d think for my EX2 as well). I’m pretty sure it is a finite and that too a small number - might be like 16 or something (could be slightly more or less) but I am not sure as so far I have only mounted just one ISO.

Cybernut1 wrote:

BTW, an off-topic question for you…if you don’t have the answer just yet, that’s fine. I never mounted any of my DVD/bluray ISOs but I do have a ton of ISOs sitting on my countless hard drives and about 50 or so sitting on my EX2. I have not mounted those - but the question I have is, do you know what the max number of ISOs we can mount on EX4 (should be the same number I’d think for my EX2 as well). I’m pretty sure it is a finite and that too a small number - might be like 16 or something (could be slightly more or less) but I am not sure as so far I have only mounted just one ISO.

I don’t mount them on the EX4 I’m afraid so cannot help.  I am still deciding on the best HTPC software to use and trialling a few, but currently use either VLC on my Mac mini (and simply let the Mac OS mount the image), or use XBMC which mounts the image itself.  Settling on XBMC I think at the moment.

Slightly related to my original post - I have noticed that some BluRay movies struggle to play and need to buffer, whereas DVD movies play perfectly.  Haven’t investigated why yet, but wonder if that too is a throughput issue.

I would think the buffering of blurays have to do with a bluray’s much higher video bitratecompared to DVD’s that translates to, yes, bandwidth issue. Hopefully your whole setup is wired by gigabit network - from the NAS (which you did say was wired up by gigabit) all the way to your Mac Mini and hopefully the Mac mini is not wireless.

Thanks for the info on the mounting. Hmm, I have never tried using HTPC software. I always burn my blurays to either a BDR or a BDRE disc and then watch them in my bluray player. Though I have thought about getting a KDLinks HD720 for some time now.

Cybernut1 wrote:

I would think the buffering of blurays have to do with a bluray’s much higher video bitratecompared to DVD’s that translates to, yes, bandwidth issue. Hopefully your whole setup is wired by gigabit network - from the NAS (which you did say was wired up by gigabit) all the way to your Mac Mini and hopefully the Mac mini is not wireless.

Thanks for the info on the mounting. Hmm, I have never tried using HTPC software. I always burn my blurays to either a BDR or a BDRE disc and then watch them in my bluray player. Though I have thought about getting a KDLinks HD720 for some time now.

Mac mini is indeed wired on gigabit to the same switch as the NAS.  Which is why I didn’t think throughput would be an issue, but this copy issue has got me thinking now if this thing ever gets any faster than this!

I am going to let this copy run it’s course (it’s been going for 48 hours now after all!).  Still worried about the imapct on the NAS components but this is what it’s designed for I guess.

Once completed I will try copying using Mac so it goes NAS to Mac to NAS and see if that speeds it up rather than NAS to NAS.  I had foolishly thought NAS to NAS would cut out any Mac or WIndows OS overheads and be much quicker!

Keys76 wrote:> I had foolishly thought NAS to NAS would cut out any Mac or WIndows OS overheads and be much quicker!> * * *

Actually, you thought wisely - NAS to NAS is better than if you had mapped the drives and initiated the copy on a computer. that would indeed produce an unncessary overhead of all data making a round-trip to your computer before reaching the target NAS.

I don’t know how exactly you copied though but one simple NAS-to-NAS direct copying would have been to setup a backup job on one EX4 and selecting the source data as a directory from the other NAS…and you’d have to set this up in the EX4 dashboard from the Backups (Remote Backups) section.

I have indeed set the copy going using a remote backup job on the first EX4 with the second as the target.

Just had a look at the running processes on the EX4’s.

On the source one I found that SSH is the main hog of CPU. While on the destination one it was SSHD.

Rsync came in second on both (which is understandable).

Your right… stepping upto any Synology or any other Marvell SoC type NAS might not solve the speed issues.

However I still stand by by assertion that the EX4 is abysmally slow as shown clearly at the near bottom of the speed ranking over at Smallnetbuilder site; even when it competes directly with other vendors products using the same SoC; it’s painfully obvious it’s not as optimized as it could be.  Combine the abysmally slow transfer speeds, the lack of effective horizontal raid migration and missing feature sets…  nfs hello…Amazon Glacier long term storage??? This unit is a dog many of us feel hoodwinked into purchasing this unit and hindsight is 20/20  I know for a variety of reasons I could not recommend this product over vastly quicker and more capable products at a small fraction of a price increase.

my honest feedback still is the best and most honest advice I can offer; if it’s disappointing you now in terms of speed when your new to the product, return it promptly and purchase any number of superior units from Drobo, Synology, or iXsystems.  Your joy with this product will NOT grow.