Some MP4 and FLV files will not play

WD Legacy Products WD TV Live Hub Discussions
1

Hi,

I just bought the WD TV Live Hub yesterday and am in the process of testing it out to make sure it will meet all my requirements for media file playback. I am writing down the issues I am finding on a cue card so I can submit them to this community forum. Many of the issues I’m finding are somewhat minor and I will group these issues into a single message post once I complete my tests.

I uncovered a more serious concern last night however, i.e. and reconfirmed the issue this morning.

I have produced some *.MP4 files using the NeroVision 9.0 SW that I use for my music business and they do not play. I tested an alternative HD media player product last weekend and this alternative product did sucessfully play these files i.e. so I have some confirmation that they are playable (i.e. I can also play them on my computer but my computer is not fast enough to properly render the full resolution etc…i.e. which is part of the reason I purchased a WD TV Live Hub unit). Another piece of information to add to this is that I also had converted a *.MOV file from a point and shoot camera I’d recently purchased to *.MP4 using a conversion sw package I had, and confirmed that this *.MP4 did indeed work correctly with the WD TV Live Hub product I’m testing…i.e. so the spec (i.e. appendix) in the manual for the WD TV Live Hub product does say that it can play *.MP4 files but it would seem there may be exceptions…i.e. so I would need to know what these exceptions are to determine if there’s a work around i.e. or hopefully if the bug or issue can be resolved. I would be happy to provide the files that do not work (i.e. *.MP4) to whomever may be able to further investigate and resolve the issue/problem.

Futher information to add to this. The MP4 files I’d produced thru NeroVision 9 were also converted to *.FLV files which I up loaded to YouTube…i.e. so these files definately work…also note that the alternative HD Media player I tested last weekend also plays these files…so there is ample confirmation that the files are playable but unfortunately these files also do not play on the WD TV Live Hub product I am testing. Once again I can  provide the files that do not work (i.e. *.FLV) to whomever may be able to further investigate and resolve the issue/problem.

Thank-you,

Charles

2

Hi,

I’m just guessing right now what might be wrong with the MP4 and FLV files that I have that do not work.

I obtained and installed a copy of MediaInfo to analyse the files that don’t work relative to the files that do work. I have not come to any conclusions yet.

It would be helpful to have a more detailed specification of what the WD TV Live Hub can play. For the sake of my analysis there is not enough information in the manual to make a determination as to the incompatibility…so I’m faced with having to guess via trial and error.

Is there a more detailed spec available on-line?

Thank-you,

Charles

3

The only ‘spec’ is in the manual.

You could post the mediainfo results on here to see if anybody can tell you why they don’t play.

4

Hi,

I just had an insight this morning that might explain in part why some of my files don’t work. Could it be a limitation of the actual TV rather than the WD TV Live Hub?

I keep mentioning this alternate HD TV box that I tested last weekend that played everything…but it’s HDMI port did not work with my TV and I was forced to use the Component interface instead (i.e. the Red, Green and Blue connectors). Is there a handshaking style protocol where if the TV can’t play a certain resolution/Frame rate it tells the playing box …sorry…can’t play this…and would the WD TV Live Hub react to this handshaking? Based on this idea I was going to try hooking up the component cables and disconnecting the HDMI port and see if this made a difference.

Regarding your idea of posting the Media info results…is there a way to attach files on this forum…or must I cut and paste the Media info results directly into the text of the forum post?

I tried converting one of the MP4 files last night using some conversion SW and eventually got it to work…that being said I would like to get to the root cause of why these files don’t work. I have a few suspicions…one of them is the verticle frame rate. The MP4 files that don’t work have a frame rate of 59.94 fps…could that be it?

Thank-you,

Charles

5

Cut and paste the results. The frame rate could be the problem.

6

The MP4 files that don’t work have a frame rate of 59.94 fps…could that be it?

That’s a good possibility…

The manual lists:

  1. VC-1 AP@L3 up to 1920x1080i30 (<60% of the B-picture macroblocks have 4 motion vectors), 1920x1080p24, or 1280x720p60
    resolution. Up to 1920x1080i25, 1920x1080p24, or 1280x720p60 resolution if unconstrained 4MV bitstream.
  2. MPEG-4.10 (H.264) BP@L3 up to 720x480p30 or 720x576p25 resolution, including FMO and ASO.
  3. MPEG-4.10 (H.264) MP@L4.1 and HP@L4.1 up to 1920x1080p24, 1920x1080i30, or 1280x720p60 resolution

So, you can only use 60fps at 1280x720, not at 1920x1080.

As Rich says, cutting and pasting will help us know for sure.

7

Just tried hooking up the component cables and disconnecting the HDMI and then powering up the WD TV Live Hub. This did not have any impact on the unplayable MP4 and FLV file situation.

I’m also working in parallel to see why some of my *.FLV files don’t work. The FLV files I produced with the conversion sw that I have produces FLV files that contain H.263 format of video…This format is not shown in the manual so I’m guessing this might be the cause. Unfortunately the conversion sw I’m using doesn’t seem to provide the option of choosing which video format to use within the FLV container…i.e. I know that the FLV files that I’ve confirmed do work all use AVC as the video format…could this be it…does anybody know of a good conversion sw that allows one to choose AVC instead of H.263 as the video format within the FLV container?

Thank-you,

Charles

8

Here’s the MediaInfo data of an MP4 files that does not play:

General

ID : 0

Complete name : D:\My Video\Concertino\20100622 Gig Rosebridge\Irish Jig.mp4

Format : BDAV

Format/Info : Blu-ray Video

File size : 91.2 MiB

Duration : 2mn 32s

Overall bit rate : 5 001 Kbps

Maximum Overall bit rate : 24.0 Mbps

Video

ID : 4113 (0x1011)

Menu ID : 1 (0x1)

Format : AVC

Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec

Format profile : High@L4.1

Format settings, CABAC : Yes

Format settings, ReFrames : 2 frames

Codec ID : 27

Duration : 2mn 32s

Bit rate mode : Constant

Bit rate : 4 602 Kbps

Nominal bit rate : 9 500 Kbps

Width : 1 920 pixels

Height : 1 080 pixels

Display aspect ratio : 16:9

Frame rate : 59.940 fps

Color space : YUV

Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0

Bit depth : 8 bits

Scan type : Progressive

Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.037

Stream size : 83.7 MiB (92%)

Audio

ID : 4352 (0x1100)

Menu ID : 1 (0x1)

Format : AC-3

Format/Info : Audio Coding 3

Mode extension : CM (complete main)

Codec ID : 129

Duration : 2mn 32s

Bit rate mode : Constant

Bit rate : 192 Kbps

Channel(s) : 2 channels

Channel positions : Front: L R

Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz

Bit depth : 16 bits

Stream size : 3.49 MiB (4%)

Here’s MediaInfo data of an FLV file that does not work:

General

Complete name : D:\My Video\Concertino\20100622 Gig Rosebridge\Irish Jig.flv

Format : Flash Video

File size : 21.0 MiB

Duration : 2mn 32s

Overall bit rate : 1 155 Kbps

Video

Format : H.263

Duration : 2mn 32s

Bit rate : 977 Kbps

Width : 640 pixels

Height : 480 pixels

Display aspect ratio : 4:3

Frame rate mode : Constant

Frame rate : 25.000 fps

Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.127

Stream size : 17.8 MiB (85%)

Audio

Format : MPEG Audio

Format version : Version 1

Format profile : Layer 3

Mode : Joint stereo

Mode extension : MS Stereo

Duration : 2mn 32s

Bit rate mode : Constant

Bit rate : 128 Kbps

Channel(s) : 2 channels

Sampling rate : 44.1 KHz

Bit depth : 16 bits

Stream size : 2.33 MiB (11%)

Writing library : LAME3.98.2

Thank-you,

Charles

9

The 60fps seems to be your issue for the .mp4.  Only 30fps is supported for 1920x1080.

As for the .flv, the Sigma brochure doesn’t mention that the chip can decode H.263 in its list of codecs, so I’m guessing there’s your problem right there, but you’d think there’d be backwards compatability with legacy codings.  Perhaps it would work if the WD would pass the signal, but the WD doesn’t see it as a “supported” codec and ignores the stream… I don’t know.  The manual certainly only says that WD supports H.264 in .flv.

10

Hi,

I have some new insights to share courtesy of something my brother experimented with this morning.

He took the *.mp4 file that does not work and renamed it to a *.mts file type and the file played. An another important misconception that this experiment clears up is with the frame rate i.e. that 1980x1080p with a 59.940 frame will indeed play on the WD TV Live Hub (i.e. as well as the original WD TV player which my brother owns and uses) (i.e. the frame rate is not limited to 29.970 or 30 fps for 1980x1080p or i  which is reassuring since this box is supposed to be able to render to the full 1080p etc.).

It would seem the issue is with my Nero 9 software and the fact that it exports to the BDAV Blueray Video format but incorrectly uses an *.mp4 file extension. What is interesting is that the alternative HD player box I tested last weekend looked past the file container and played the video correctly anyway.

One thing I am disappointed in with regards to how the WD TV Live Hub behaves with respect playback of video files is in the case of *.mts (i.e. Blueray format) is that there is a very long delay at the start of playing a file, approximately 5-7s where the audio is muted out with an annoying status bar and such on bottom of the screen as well as a square that appears in middle of the screen after around 4 seconds that says the file type and the fact that subtitles is turned off…this diminishes the overall experience of being able to playback the file. There seems to be no way to turn this off. Even rewinding to the beginning does not allow one to properly view the first 5-10 seconds of the file. Perhaps this is something that can be resolved?

Thank-you,

Charles

11

That annoying box in the centre of the screen was complained about on the WDTV Live and after some time was deleted. 

That update is obviously being ignored by the developers of the hub even though they have been told a number of times.

We can only hope that sometime some it will be gone.